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Location (city or town)GreymouthEventPre- European Maori trails to the West Coast
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Category TagMaori
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Date Created26th October 2021CommentsKerry Molloy
Re the map shown and specifically the kotuku site.The discovery of what was in fact an adze head was made by Mr Colin Dehn who farmed on Mears hill and was ploughing his paddock alongside the Arnold River when the plough hit the item bringing it out of the furrow .seeing it had a hole bored in it -he took it to Molloy Bros garage where my late father Kevin Molloy was head mechanic. Dad inserted IIRC a 5/8"drill bit through the hole .A decision was made and Canterbury Museum was contacted. The then curator Dr Roger Duff duly travelled to the site with a team of archeologists and excavated the site .Dad stated it was In Dr Duffs opinion a smallish greenstone working camp possibly transient in nature
Kerry Molloy
however in the last two years Ihave been informed certain maori persons in the grey district were aware of a unique deposit of pounamu of a very unusual type around the Aritika area.My informant stated apparently this was held in very high esteem and only used in gifts for the most highly ranked persons in the tribal groups. Given the close proximity of the deposit and the discovery also the Arnold river as a travel route it may well have been where this stone was worked in secret.
Naireen Bass
I have done the Harpers Pass tramp, starting at Windy Point & ending after crossing the Taramakau River. Great tramp.
Lorraine Anderson
Thank you for sharing
Patricia Henry
I have a pendant made from greenstone that Jack Honey had found. It was a big rock if I remember correctly
Christopher Randal
That is really interesting , thank you
Ken Duncan
my fathers Great Uncle used to cross Copelands pass to Mt Cook Hermitage where he & others of our people such as George Bannister were alpine guides(George at age of 18 was the guide who took the first Europeans to top of Aoraki/Mt Cook) then was rejected for service in WW1 for having flat feet after walking from South Westland to Hokitika to volunteer. Took Butler about 15 hours when he had no work to leave the Hermitage go up to Copelands then down to welcome flat where he had left his horse. the track to the Copeland was cut by our people following their old tracks.
Barry Sheard
I remember throwing my boots away halfway between Mudflats Hut and Newton Creek Hut because they were hobnail boots and the nails were coming through. We (Glenn Johnston, Fred Ross, Duncan Hamilton & myself) went as far as Olderog creek and then back the way we had come. still prefer bare feet to shoes.
Dorothy Wills
Extraordinary, I wonder just how far they would have travelled, I mean in ( miles ) kms on that journey
15h
Pete Lusk
Maori were a very adventurous people. After all, their Polynesian ancestors had come right across the Pacific, gone to Sth America and back, discovered Easter Is and Hawaii….and Aotearoa/NZ.
Then when they established themselves here, they needed routes through the Alps. These weren’t easy to find because you can’t view any of them from the coast, or even half way up the rivers.
You really have to explore…go up all the main rivers, up the side rivers, then up the side creeks…and then finally you’ll discover the passes.
I’m guessing Maori would wait for summer when rivers were down, and most snow was gone, before searching about. It’s not logical to traipse about in winter and spring. In contrast, summer and autumn in the mountains can be benign.
Andy Nelson
I think they used to also go up the Blue Grey River and come out around hospital flat in the Maruia springs area.. does this sound right?
Joe Kelly
To cross those mountains without modern footwear or rain gear or tents they must have really, really tough.
Carol Cameron
How does that work NZ wasn’t mapped pre European??
Pete Lusk
Carol Cameron it’s like the modern day tramper…you store the routes in your brain….a mind map.
There’s a map of the Southern Lakes, drawn for an early pakeha adventurer by a Maori. The map has all the big lakes in the right place, and names given. And all out of his mind.
I could do the same with places I’m familiar with, eg Mokihinui R and its many tributaries.
Cedric Trounson
Carol Cameron Rivers and waterways existed even before Maori came and represented known Geograhical locations, not to mention the importance of Touch Stones along the way
Anarchist History of New Zealand
·
Carol Cameron It doesn't work.
Or Browning, Whitcome, Lauper, Dobson, Harper were right clowns. All they had to do was consult a Maori mind map rather than break their necks exploring? Or hire a guide? You'd think one of them would have thought of that if such a possibility existed.
Heather Newby
Author
Admin
Carol Cameron oral history
Heather Newby
Author
Admin
Cedric Trounson and they used cabbage trees as markers
G
Anarchist History of New Zealand
·
I don't think so, Tim.
Maoris did not have roads or passes or ‘ancient traditional knowledge’ according to their own witness. The last great West Coast chief, Werita Tainui, was asked how his invasion force crossed the mountains. “As for tracks for the war parties,” he says, “they did without them.” A big river like the Grey was followed to its source and then when the mountains were crossed the trekers “followed a stream flowing the other way.” Ref. Old Westland, Lord (e1976)
Phil Millar
Pre European was never mapped so this is incorect,i though Administraton would have picked this up ?
Greg Mait
Phil Millar this would be a description of an oral history incorporated into maps of today.
Phil Millar
By whom please?
Bog Smith
Phil Millarthe talky people
Glenn Johnston
Greg Mait Correct! Based on maps drawn freehand by Maori for the early explorers and surveyors plus oral record of names of features along the routes.
Glenn Johnston
Many Maori are recorded as supplying such information. eg. "Heaphy was amazed at Kehu's ability to describe to him each night the journey ahead of them the next day. He had a detailed knowledge of the place names and shape of each section of the trail ahead". Note the words "shape of each section". Sounds like a map in Kehu's head to me. Maps are not just lines and words on paper. However, post European contact some Maori drew maps on paper for the Europeans or would sketch such by drawing in the earth with a stick etc. Scale was a different concept more akin to walking time than kilometers and meters though.
Glenn Johnston
My piece in quotation marks above is from the book Greenstone Trails by Barry Brailsford. Lo and behold I found the thread starter map in the same book so I was correct in thinking it may be from a Brailsford work.
Glenn Johnston
I've walked all of those passes and on several of the routes there were signs of early Maori usage such as caves or overhangs which had been used as camp sites. I doubt that Mathias Pass got much use at all as it seems rather impractical for physical and geographic reasons plus oral tradition as far as I am aware states that this was not a good route to use. This appears to be a Barry Brailsford map? Barry grew up in Greymouth?
David-Kat Jonathan-Bell
I'm intrigued by the reasoning of such path
Ed Dando
Been over whitcombe pass great country
Nigel Jayes
Awesome they must have been hardy souls trekking through the alps , got to admire there spirit
Shannon Ford
Hmm the smart ones woulda gone by Waka!
Chris Bensemann
I've walked part of those trails they are natural contour main ridges. The routes are similar location to European deer hunters. It is also is believed to be Moa County.
Murray Stewart
That Waimakariri trail is totally impossible
Ed Dando
Been over whitcombe pass great country
Nigel Jayes
Awesome they must have been hardy souls trekking through the alps , got to admire there spirit
Shannon Ford
Hmm the smart ones woulda gone by Waka!
Chris Bensemann
I've walked part of those trails they are natural contour main ridges. The routes are similar location to European deer hunters. It is also is believed to be Moa County.
Murray Stewart
That Waimakariri trail is totally impossible
Re the map shown and specifically the kotuku site.The discovery of what was in fact an adze head was made by Mr Colin Dehn who farmed on Mears hill and was ploughing his paddock alongside the Arnold River when the plough hit the item bringing it out of the furrow .seeing it had a hole bored in it -he took it to Molloy Bros garage where my late father Kevin Molloy was head mechanic. Dad inserted IIRC a 5/8"drill bit through the hole .A decision was made and Canterbury Museum was contacted. The then curator Dr Roger Duff duly travelled to the site with a team of archeologists and excavated the site .Dad stated it was In Dr Duffs opinion a smallish greenstone working camp possibly transient in nature
Kerry Molloy
however in the last two years Ihave been informed certain maori persons in the grey district were aware of a unique deposit of pounamu of a very unusual type around the Aritika area.My informant stated apparently this was held in very high esteem and only used in gifts for the most highly ranked persons in the tribal groups. Given the close proximity of the deposit and the discovery also the Arnold river as a travel route it may well have been where this stone was worked in secret.
Naireen Bass
I have done the Harpers Pass tramp, starting at Windy Point & ending after crossing the Taramakau River. Great tramp.
Lorraine Anderson
Thank you for sharing
Patricia Henry
I have a pendant made from greenstone that Jack Honey had found. It was a big rock if I remember correctly
Christopher Randal
That is really interesting , thank you
Ken Duncan
my fathers Great Uncle used to cross Copelands pass to Mt Cook Hermitage where he & others of our people such as George Bannister were alpine guides(George at age of 18 was the guide who took the first Europeans to top of Aoraki/Mt Cook) then was rejected for service in WW1 for having flat feet after walking from South Westland to Hokitika to volunteer. Took Butler about 15 hours when he had no work to leave the Hermitage go up to Copelands then down to welcome flat where he had left his horse. the track to the Copeland was cut by our people following their old tracks.
Barry Sheard
I remember throwing my boots away halfway between Mudflats Hut and Newton Creek Hut because they were hobnail boots and the nails were coming through. We (Glenn Johnston, Fred Ross, Duncan Hamilton & myself) went as far as Olderog creek and then back the way we had come. still prefer bare feet to shoes.
Dorothy Wills
Extraordinary, I wonder just how far they would have travelled, I mean in ( miles ) kms on that journey
15h
Pete Lusk
Maori were a very adventurous people. After all, their Polynesian ancestors had come right across the Pacific, gone to Sth America and back, discovered Easter Is and Hawaii….and Aotearoa/NZ.
Then when they established themselves here, they needed routes through the Alps. These weren’t easy to find because you can’t view any of them from the coast, or even half way up the rivers.
You really have to explore…go up all the main rivers, up the side rivers, then up the side creeks…and then finally you’ll discover the passes.
I’m guessing Maori would wait for summer when rivers were down, and most snow was gone, before searching about. It’s not logical to traipse about in winter and spring. In contrast, summer and autumn in the mountains can be benign.
Andy Nelson
I think they used to also go up the Blue Grey River and come out around hospital flat in the Maruia springs area.. does this sound right?
Joe Kelly
To cross those mountains without modern footwear or rain gear or tents they must have really, really tough.
Carol Cameron
How does that work NZ wasn’t mapped pre European??
Pete Lusk
Carol Cameron it’s like the modern day tramper…you store the routes in your brain….a mind map.
There’s a map of the Southern Lakes, drawn for an early pakeha adventurer by a Maori. The map has all the big lakes in the right place, and names given. And all out of his mind.
I could do the same with places I’m familiar with, eg Mokihinui R and its many tributaries.
Cedric Trounson
Carol Cameron Rivers and waterways existed even before Maori came and represented known Geograhical locations, not to mention the importance of Touch Stones along the way
Anarchist History of New Zealand
·
Carol Cameron It doesn't work.
Or Browning, Whitcome, Lauper, Dobson, Harper were right clowns. All they had to do was consult a Maori mind map rather than break their necks exploring? Or hire a guide? You'd think one of them would have thought of that if such a possibility existed.
Heather Newby
Author
Admin
Carol Cameron oral history
Heather Newby
Author
Admin
Cedric Trounson and they used cabbage trees as markers
G
Anarchist History of New Zealand
·
I don't think so, Tim.
Maoris did not have roads or passes or ‘ancient traditional knowledge’ according to their own witness. The last great West Coast chief, Werita Tainui, was asked how his invasion force crossed the mountains. “As for tracks for the war parties,” he says, “they did without them.” A big river like the Grey was followed to its source and then when the mountains were crossed the trekers “followed a stream flowing the other way.” Ref. Old Westland, Lord (e1976)
Phil Millar
Pre European was never mapped so this is incorect,i though Administraton would have picked this up ?
Greg Mait
Phil Millar this would be a description of an oral history incorporated into maps of today.
Phil Millar
By whom please?
Bog Smith
Phil Millarthe talky people
Glenn Johnston
Greg Mait Correct! Based on maps drawn freehand by Maori for the early explorers and surveyors plus oral record of names of features along the routes.
Glenn Johnston
Many Maori are recorded as supplying such information. eg. "Heaphy was amazed at Kehu's ability to describe to him each night the journey ahead of them the next day. He had a detailed knowledge of the place names and shape of each section of the trail ahead". Note the words "shape of each section". Sounds like a map in Kehu's head to me. Maps are not just lines and words on paper. However, post European contact some Maori drew maps on paper for the Europeans or would sketch such by drawing in the earth with a stick etc. Scale was a different concept more akin to walking time than kilometers and meters though.
Glenn Johnston
My piece in quotation marks above is from the book Greenstone Trails by Barry Brailsford. Lo and behold I found the thread starter map in the same book so I was correct in thinking it may be from a Brailsford work.
Glenn Johnston
I've walked all of those passes and on several of the routes there were signs of early Maori usage such as caves or overhangs which had been used as camp sites. I doubt that Mathias Pass got much use at all as it seems rather impractical for physical and geographic reasons plus oral tradition as far as I am aware states that this was not a good route to use. This appears to be a Barry Brailsford map? Barry grew up in Greymouth?
David-Kat Jonathan-Bell
I'm intrigued by the reasoning of such path
Ed Dando
Been over whitcombe pass great country
Nigel Jayes
Awesome they must have been hardy souls trekking through the alps , got to admire there spirit
Shannon Ford
Hmm the smart ones woulda gone by Waka!
Chris Bensemann
I've walked part of those trails they are natural contour main ridges. The routes are similar location to European deer hunters. It is also is believed to be Moa County.
Murray Stewart
That Waimakariri trail is totally impossible
Ed Dando
Been over whitcombe pass great country
Nigel Jayes
Awesome they must have been hardy souls trekking through the alps , got to admire there spirit
Shannon Ford
Hmm the smart ones woulda gone by Waka!
Chris Bensemann
I've walked part of those trails they are natural contour main ridges. The routes are similar location to European deer hunters. It is also is believed to be Moa County.
Murray Stewart
That Waimakariri trail is totally impossible
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West Coast New Zealand History (29th Sep 2024). ALBUM - Pre- European Maori trails to the West Coast.. In Website West Coast New Zealand History. Retrieved 8th Apr 2026 00:00, from https://westcoast.recollect.co.nz/nodes/view/30275